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TOPIC: Hasbro and circles of hell

Hasbro and circles of hell 1 year 10 months ago #6512

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Hasbro and the Circles of Hell
I, like many of you, have watched the unfolding drama that is the OGL debate. It prompted me to think about what I want from the game that I have played for over 40 years. It prompted me think about which of the particular virtues and sins surrounding this debate. This in turn led me to thinking about a scenario I played long ago called inferno (Judges Guild) 1980, which has the characters tour Hell and examine their very souls prior to reaching salvation, eternal damnation, or (for some) reprieve and another turn at the wheel.
It seem to me that the debate around the OGL has the same plot line. So, l put my thoughts on this in same terms as that old inferno campaign, I thought of it a bit of a parody that might amuse, and/or help structure my thoughts and I decided I might share it!

For those that don't know, Inferno is a scenario for character levels 10-14, set in the circles of Hell as described by Dante. It is expected that these characters are experienced, and, for whatever reason, have found themselves in hell. Some good people end up there, as a trial, and test of their purity, others are there damned by their actions, but those in the scenario are still alive and capable of changing things… it seems to me that some of the leaks pre-empting this round of OGL discussion come from those testing their souls, some underlying policy lines ascribed to avaricious faceless mega corps (I’m looking at you Hasbro), may be already damned by their actions, and some architects of the current dilemma may be seeking salvation or damnation in equal measure as they try to balance both sides.

For those not familiar with Hell, it has 9 circles, each with a theme, a ruling archduke whose aim is to ensure the unending suffering of those within his or her care, and clear organisation, indexing and that suffering to ensure each soul has exactly the penance it has deserved… (I reproduce some of Matt Spragg’s url=https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/articles/a-visitors-guide-to-dantes-nine-circles-of-hell/]link[/url words as I found them funny, but I have amended them to align to the OGL thing)

First Circle: Limbo
The first circle is home to the unbaptized and virtuous pagans, or, if you prefer, the non D&D gamers. You have the desires, and the ability, but clearly lack the clarity of the true faith. It’s not Heaven, but as far as Hell goes, it isn’t too bad: It’s the retirement community of the afterlife. Some of you favourite authors are there, Lovecraft, Ansell, Halliwell, will be your neighbours, so any attempt at games talk will probably turn varied endless rounds of tabletop battlefield games, miniatures and gothic horror. You’ll have television, but all of the channels will be set to play endless re-runs of Hawk the Slayer, and Krull.
These folks all mean well, and its clear these non believers in the D&D dream will simply exist… in the very realm that holds its name.

Second Circle: Lust
The wind-buffeted second circle of Hell is the final destination of the lustful and adulterous — basically anyone controlled by their hormones. Cleopatra and Helen of Troy were among its most famous residents during Dante’s day, but you can expect this place to be full of all those folks who lusted after fame for its own sake, reality television stars, Critical Roll folks and others whose abuse of the game, has lead to deviant behaviour. By the time you arrive, you can expect screens with endless Critical Rolls sessions all showing you how inferior you are as a gamer, as these others bask in your adoration.
You might, it being the realm of lust, manage a quickie game of MTG behind the bike sheds with your mates, but the cards will all be land… you have all the power you need, but nothing to do with it. Your only choice is not to play, or watch your betters on the big screens enjoying themselves.

Third Circle: Gluttony
Today’s forecast calls for plenty of icy rain and slush — a “wintery mix” for all eternity. It breeds a special kind of indulgence common to RPGer’s you will find many fat blokes in corners, busy downing beer, crisps, and other RPG staples as part of their endless task to energise for THE GAME. Oh yes, they have the game, it lies on the tables before them, all the editions, all the extra source material, all the figures and game tools ever needed, the choice is endless… and that’s exactly what you get. Endless choice, endless discussion, endless variety and ultimately no substance, because the poor fools subject to Gluttony never get to consume anything worth while…
The poor gluttonous souls are doomed to forever buy the next, and newest, the variants and the homebrew, they forget that its only a game of our collective making, and we don’t need to be told what to imagine, they have to told.
Your choice is not to play and starve endlessly at a table filled with every delicacy…

Fourth Circle: Greed
This section of Hell is reserved for the money-grubbers and overly materialistic among us. It clearly is the resting place of those seeking to profit from the game, and all who make a living from that game. Archduke Hasbro may be in charge, but his rule is not absolute, and he tries with mailed fist to crush opposition. That opposition, clearly entitled, clearly equally as intoxicated with the wealth of their creations, but fail to recognise that its life blood, the source, is forever part of their very being, and in the end, you take the devils coin, you sacrifice your soul…
According to Dante, those condemned to the fourth circle spend eternity fighting over money and valuables, so be prepared to meet all those who show up out of nowhere with empty trucks moments after the game dies. Will they be better custodians of the source than the last. George Orwell said it… all are equal… but some are more equal than others.

Fifth Circle: Anger
Dante tells us that the wrathful and angry souls of this circle spend eternity waging battle on the River of Styx. If the Styx is the soul of the game, then the warring armies of corporate pirates forever battling over it sounds like an eternity of hell.
So join them, hoist the Jolly Roger and go to war against the guys that made the game for the good of us all, use that righteous bottled up road rage-possessed drive to slay the beast and recover your soul, just remember, when it dies, nothing will be the same, everything will be empty, and once your rage has gone you are left with… nothing. It was once said... better the devil you know.

Sixth Circle: Heresy
Ahh yes, Heresy, Dante wrote that heretics spent eternity entombed in flaming crypts in the sixth circle, but heresy is kind of an obscure sin in these modern times. Clearly those who don’t believe as I do are wrong, but are they all wrong? What if they are just slightly wrong? What if their argument is sound but their interpretation flawed, where does tolerance, and acceptance that mistakes can be made fall. We have the solution. Let us all have the right, and the might to self determination and absolutism. Let use all have the right to be enraged. Let us all measure the worth of others arguments in sentiments that they can never share/know/understand because we cannot properly define. Yes! Let there be gaming WOKE!
There’s probably plenty of vacancies now, so let’s fill this tier of hell with anyone who goes bananas whenever “their” game is threatened by change, whenever someone who owns a thing, has the right to change the thing can be denied, and more particularly whenever we feel something that we just don’t like them changing OUR thing. The air in the sixth circle is probably choked with ashes and anguished cries of “[X] ruined my childhood!”. “[X] ruined my game!”
The solution is not to play. Enjoy the 6th level of hell, welcome to the realm of heresy…

Seventh Circle: Violence
Violence, in roleplaying? Never! Clearly we would never condone such a thing. Dante was being kind of a dick when it came to designing this level. It is composed of three rings. The outer ring is filled with blood and fire and reserved for murderers and thugs ("not us your honour we are upstanding roleplayers", whatever the system, whatever the base, we NEVER commit murder, set fire to things, pillage anything.... Clearly we follow the axiom from “He’s dead, what do we do?. Clearly we go through his pockets for loose change). That’s fine, but it gets sketchier from here. The middle ring is where, according to Dante, suicide victims go, (not a thing in RPG I hear you cry, you ever played traveller? No, well you passed the heretic level so clearly not). The Suicides are transformed into trees and fed upon by harpies (which I guess are somehow related to termites?). The inner ring, a place of burning sand, is reserved for “blasphemers” and “sodomites.” How about we ret-con this one (Sorry, residents of the sixth circle…) and reserve it for the likes of the Hasbro executives and those who willingly deny the game for ‘altruistic’ reasons – two sides of the same blasphemy?
Leading a life of violence doesn’t need to be violent. Emotional turmoil, blasphemy against the game, failing to acknowledge the right of what has gone before, I guess the choice is yours to determine if not playing is blasphemy and if so, level 7 is all for you.

Eighth Circle: Fraud
The eighth circle is subdivided into ten trenches, (Bolgia). We won’t get into the specifics of who goes where (Too bad, Dante), but the 3rd Bolgia specifically for Simoniacs and Grafters seems to apply. Simony, the buying and selling of ‘church’ property, seems an apt enough allegory for the game… after all the buying and selling of the think we all hold so dear, indeed dear enough to make it almost religion, must carry with it some sin. Indeed, is simony not the very core of the issue at hand. We hold our spiritual ownership of our childhood game in such regard that those who willingly and with malice aforethought seek to damage or destroy that game need to be struck down with great vengeance and furious anger! but alas this is the 5th circle and Mr Jackson may not approve the stealing of his trope!
The point here is the 8th circle is where you’ll find con artists of all sorts. Dante described ditches, into which the soulless salesman are poured.

• Bolgia 1 panderers and seducers
• Bolgia 2 Flatters and deceivers
• Bolgia 3 Simoniacs
• Bolgia 4 Astrologers, seers, and sorcerors
• Bolgia 5 Grafters (extortionists, speculators, businessmen, blackmailers)
• Bolgia 6 Hypocrites
• Bolgia 7 Thieves
• Bolgia 8 Fraudulent Consellors
• Bolgia 9 Sowers of scandal
• Bolgia 10 Falsifiers
That just about covers everyone. Welcome to the 8th circle, everyone, there is a pit here just for you.

Ninth Circle: Treachery
The final circle is a frozen wasteland occupied by history’s greatest traitors. Those whose crimes are so grotesque, that the endless frozen barren wasteland, and eternity spent in their own power crazed, deceiving, self deluded existence are the only punishment. They ask no solace because it cannot come, they seek no respite because they hold to the principle of what they did, they will not play the game on a point of principle, without recognising that the only ones trapped in the hurt are themselves. Truly the night circle is a hell of one’s own imagination, held in place by the sure convictions of the sinners therein.

Welcome to the 9th circle of hell, all ye who enter shall forsake the game and your lives be as dust!

Hopefully you enjoyed that bit of fun. As I finish writing it, I realised that I will continue to play D&D 5e, mainly as I’ve paid for it, and enjoy it, and don’t feel the need to stop playing as that decision only affects me and my players, and doesn’t do anything to Hasbro or WoTC. Fair play to those of you who take a stance, I respect that social comment on those who do (all power to you!).
D&D will no doubt continue in some form irrespective of how all this pans out, those of use with the material can continue to play it, but simply show our displeasure with OGL issues by not purchasing any more WoTC stuff or renewing online subscriptions that support the Devil incarnate Hasbro. In my opinion, using the game, being seen to use the game, and no supporting Hasbro whilst we are doing it, makes the point more eloquently than stopping! Hey we may even be encouraged to write some of our own!

Enjoy gaming all!
Red Wine should always be opened and allowed to breathe....

if it doesn't apply mouth to bottle resuscitation.
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Hasbro and circles of hell 1 year 10 months ago #6524

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While I comprehended a fraction of that, I will say my own righteous anger lasted until the Pathfinder 2e rulebook turned up, then I was like "FK this noise, maybe Wizards will atone!" :whistle:

I imagine most of us have a massive backlog of D&D stuff to work through before before we have to throw cash at Wizards for anything new, but how you spend your money and time is a personal decision.

My big concern is that Wizards/Hasbro are trying to kill the actual tabletop gaming scene and get everyone online, paying for their AI DMs, and whatever else they are denying is in the pipeline. We'll see how that pans out in due course.

"Enjoy gaming all!"
Last Edit: 1 year 10 months ago by mikeawmids.
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Hasbro and circles of hell 1 year 10 months ago #6529

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WotC Backs Down: Original OGL To Be Left Untouched; Whole 5E Rules Released as Creative Commons

Stand down everyone.

WotC have abandoned their attack on the OGL, so nobody has to play Pathfinder 2e.

God bless us one and all!
Last Edit: 1 year 10 months ago by mikeawmids.
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Hasbro and circles of hell 1 year 10 months ago #6532

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Is pathfinder 2e that bad?
You're on the other side of the rabbit hole. Now it's time to die.
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Hasbro and circles of hell 1 year 10 months ago #6533

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I would rather learn Pathfinder than encourage the sorts of crap WOTC are trying to pull.

They've failed for now, but they'll try and monetize the hell out of d&d in other ways.

I've got a couple of 5e campaigns left to run, but after that I'm done with it. I can't in good conscience promote a system that is actively trying to rip players off and take their money unnecessarily.
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Hasbro and circles of hell 1 year 10 months ago #6534

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Steboacha wrote:
Is pathfinder 2e that bad?

Hiya Steve, it's nice to see you're still about. :)
"Gentlemen, we're in the stickiest situation since Sticky the stick insect got stuck on a sticky bun" - Capt. E. Blackadder.
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mikeawmids - Thu 28 Nov - 16:28

Woah, Duck City Oulawsd would have been a much better game.

mikeawmids - Thu 28 Nov - 16:28

In case anyone missed my post in the game thread, no Duk City Outlaws game tonight due to work conflict.

Sarge - Thu 28 Nov - 08:39

Apologies but I'm not able to make the game tonight. I'll likely be popping down the club but won't be stopping

Garuda - Thu 21 Nov - 19:48

Lots of snow. Not stopping. See you next week. Sorry

stew - Thu 21 Nov - 19:30

Sorry Paul and players not going to make it tonight ,hammering down with snow, see you all next week .

mikeawmids - Thu 21 Nov - 14:34

Thanks for the heads up. Hope you both feel better soon! That leaves just one player + DM, so Dusk City game is cancelled.

Temrane - Thu 21 Nov - 13:59

hello heisters, myself and Jake won't be around tonight, I may of given him my illness! apologies

TheRanger - Thu 14 Nov - 13:20

Nedroxath peeps. Not gonna be there tonight as not feeling well. Sorry for any inconvenience and see you all next week

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